Comments on RJ's playboy club get together?

Thank you Sandi. I was beginning to think I was caught in a time warp until I found your post and the resulting discussion.

I had made a blog post on this subject a couple of days ago titled, "Why Are These Guys Associating Themselves with The Sexist Homophobic Rich Jerk?"

I started a thread on a relatively new Internet marketing forum called "ForumKnowHow". I anticipated that some members of that forum would disagree with what I said (click here to read my blog post) but I had no idea that every single member who responded disagreed with me, accused me of imposing my moral views on others, of being "politically correct," of not understanding a good marketing plan, of being opposed to free speech, etc., etc.

The owner of the forum, Robert Puddy, threatened to "lock" the thread because he said it was a "pointless" discussion. After I responded to some of the posts I agreed that if I kept debating back and forth with them that it probably wouldn't serve much purpose--since it was clear we disagreed and weren't going to change each others' minds. However, I said that I hoped he didn't lock down the thread because it had only been up for half a day and other members might have some unique perspectives and insights that we might all learn from.

I went to bed thinking, "there's got to be some women and enlightened men who belong to this forum who will post tomorrow." Oh, I forgot to mention that all the people who posted were men. After getting my daughter some breakfast and ready for summer camp I checked my email. I had received some notices of comments on the thread I had started, I clicked the link to see what other members had said, and then received a message that read, "that thread does not exist."

The owner had deleted the entire thread.

Rather ironic that with all the talk about the Rich Jerk's "right to free speech" that the thread was censored, don't you think?

So it was like a breath of fresh air to find this forum. Thank you for taking the initiative and to all those who responded.

All the Best,

Mark

Originally Posted by Sandi Bowman

Just wondering if anyone else, male or female, is having some questions raised about the latest from the 'Rich Jerk'? Seems like he's hosting a bachelor type marketing party via the Playboy Club.

Despite being 'invited' several times, I ask you: what woman in her right mind would even consider putting herself in such a situation, assuming it was 'allowed' unless she was bunny type herself? Get real, folks!

This is no more a marketing get together (despite the list of attendees) than it is a kids birthday party...but you can bet our taxes will be increased to pay for all the 'business write-offs' as a result of it.

I most strenuously object to such obvious sexism...charity or not. Just a variation on the 'old boys club' that women who wanted to conduct business had to fight against for years.

I know boys will be boys and that's okay in its place. IMHO it has no place in business.

Sandi Bowman

Glad you found us, Mark.

Thanks for sharing your experience and comments.

Sandi Bowman

Hello Mark and welcome to the Seeds of Wisdom Publishing Forum.

I guess I know one forum I wont' be joining. With both the responses you received (rejecting your post, defending the "Mansion" party) and the thread being removed, tells me a lot about that group.

There are plenty of other business forums out there to choose from, and not associate with the type that would label someone a prude for the reasons you objected to the "fundraiser".

Dennis Bevers

Originally Posted by DBeavers

Hello Mark and welcome to the Seeds of Wisdom Publishing Forum.

I guess I know one forum I wont' be joining. With both the responses you received (rejecting your post, defending the "Mansion" party) and the thread being removed, tells me a lot about that group.

There are plenty of other business forums out there to choose from, and not associate with the type that would label someone a prude for the reasons you objected to the "fundraiser".

Dennis Bevers

Thank you Dennis.

And to add to the list, the Warrior Forum, the largest Internet marketing forum around, deleted a 3-page thread much of which was critical of the Playboy Party.

When I and others asked what happened to the thread, Allen Says, owner of the forum proceeded to delete our accounts.

Meanwhile, the Jerk was allowed to post a defense of his purported donation to charity, which many had questioned because the charity itself denied any knowledge of the Rich Jerk's promised donation; the only links to their site came from a poker site; and the charity wasn't registered as a 503 (c) nonprofit corporation. The Jerk didn't directly address all of the questions but then he really didn't need to because they had all been deleted by Mr. Says and his platoon of moderators.

By the way, many women voiced their concern about the event as did an equal number of men. But they were all deleted too.

For all the talk about free speech by the Jerk's defenders it's supremely ironic that those who questioned or criticised his sexist, homophobic tactics were censored.

Mark

I agree with you all. I haven't seen his latest gross pics that fly under the guise of "business", but I deleted my subscription when he started getting WAY out of hand some months ago. Btw, that's when he first started advertising that par-tay, too. Don't worry, there are always going to be people who WILL attend & WILL take up for him, but take heart - - those are the same people who will belong to another, more undesirable club together, too ...maybe even meet again sometime at the local clinic...

Well, can't be helped...we tried to tell 'em! ~lol~

I've started a new Squidoo Lens to expose the Rich Jerk's sexist, homophobic advertising and to spur others to take action to oppose this decay in ethical standards:

The Rich Jerk's Sexist, Homophobic Advertising
http://www.squidoo.com/rich-jerk-sex...ic-advertising

Also see Jennifer Knox's Lens:

Internet Marketing and Women: Concerns About "Rich Jerk" Marketing
http://www.squidoo.com/marketingandwomen/

I note in my Lens that Sandi was the first marketer to speak out on this issue as far as I can tell. Bravo!

All the Best,

Mark

Thanks, Mark, but the real kudos should go to the other men and women who had the courage to stand up and be counted in this, and other, threads.

I followed your link, and several others that I found as a result. I even read every one of the Paul Galloway comments as well as his original posts. Most of the posts were supportive of his position, a few disagreed with some points, and a couple came right out in support of the opposition position. Fascinating reading.

Just wanted to thank everyone for their input. Your voices of integrity and examples of shining character as examples for future generations are more plentiful than I would have ever suspected. Thanks for helping to ensure a better future for all.

Sandi Bowman

Mark,

Thanks for taking action.

Are we feeling the Outrage yet? HA!

Quick Question. You have mention the RJ is Homophobic. I read his sales letter and didn't see any thing to indicate that. Maybe I missed it? WHERE is the evidence to back up the Label you just threw at him?

Michael Ross

Originally Posted by MichaelRoss

Quick Question. You have mention the RJ is Homophobic. I read his sales letter and didn't see any thing to indicate that. Maybe I missed it? WHERE is the evidence to back up the Label you just threw at him?

You have seen this, correct? If not, skip to the end. If you still have doubts, I'd love to hear them.

Mark,

Thanks for linking to the video.

Unfortunately, they want me to Sign Up to view it. And I'm not going to sign up to something to help you prove your point. How about you give us a Transcript of the bit that you Think makes him Homophobic.

Which leaves his PS, "No gays allowed." How does that make him Homophobic?

Seriously? Gay means bright, bubbly, cheery happy.

It's also been used as a term of ridicule and to Knock something or express your dislike at something. E.g. You see a car that you don't like the look of and you think the airbrushing on the side is silly and you remark, "That car is so Gay."

Some Same Sex Fetishists do refer to themselves as Gay.

Now, his PS might mean, he doesn't want any Happy people there. And going by his Angry Boy writing style I could clearly see that. He might also not want any Stupid Heads, Idiots, Morons and other's like that which he calls Gay. And third, he might not want Homosexuals - as if he'd know how to spot one.

To add more. If he does mean Same Sex Fetishists he just might not want them at this event because... he knows they won't have a good time (unless they are Female Same Sex Fetishists). And so he makes that "No gays allowed" remark. However, that does not mean the man has an overall prejudice against Same sex Fetishists.

Based on the above, it is a stretch to call the man Homophobic.

I'm not giving the man a pass - I've already expressed what I think of the matter elsewhere in this thread. But I'm hardly going to accuse the man of being Homophobic due to three written words. Otherwise it's similar to the games played by the likes of Jesse Jackson who wants to make Everything about race - so the Other side then wastes time defending a Label that shouldn't have been thrown in the first place, and the original topic is lost.

If, on the other boards in which there was deletion, you were more outraged and zealotry in calling names, then I can understand your message being deleted by the board owner.

Because it's Their Board and, like a newspaper, they have an onus on what stays up and is available to be read. If you call someone a name, or call them a Prejudicial Label, you had better be able to back it up otherwise the message will be deleted. It's that simple. (Say what you want on your own website or blog, but don't expect others to put themselves on the Libel/Slander Line for you.)

And so far, I see no evidence to throw a label around like that. Maybe the video shows something different. Like if he'd said he Hates Homosexuals or something. But writing "No Gays Allowed" does not make him any more homophobic than a store having "No smoking allowed" makes them Smokerphobic or a sign that says "No Skateboarding" makes the place Skateboarderphobic. Such places can have signs due to Insurance Liabilities.

Michael Ross